Fred Franztone

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Posts by Fred Franztone

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  23

  Why did you leave?

  by Fred Franztone in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  we all have many reasons for leaving, most are doctrinal, some are emotional.

  it's a religion which obsesses over factual proofs (counterfactual though they are) of its veracity rather than faith, so it's inevitable that most who leave will do so for intellectual reasons.

  which doctrine above all others forced you to reconsider your position?

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  Fred Franztone

  I never said anything about being disfellowshipped
• 
  29

  conversation with a JW about the sun

  by neat blue dog in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  jw: didn't we just hear somebody say that the sun's gonna blow up?.

  me: well, they were saying that it will expand and eventually burn out.. jw: but it can't do that, it just keeps blowing up inside and getting more power.. me: well, they were talking about stars in general, how they have a life span.. jw: but god didn't make it that way, it's firmly established to time indefinite.

  it's not like the sun is a regular star.

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  Fred Franztone

  2. Our sun might not actually become a Red Giant either, it may just collapse down upon itself to become a white dwarf.

  It will most certainly become a red giant, twice in fact, before the outer layers are blown away, leaving a white dwarf
  
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  4

  Facts Don't Win Fights: Here’s How to Cut Through Confirmation Bias

  by Brokeback Watchtower in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  finding common ground more likely to work.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kyiozodhkbe.

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  Fred Franztone

  I have no common ground with JWs
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  40

  This probably sounds uppity. I'm saying it anyhow

  by stillin in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  has anybody else noticed a pattern that is here among us outcasts?

  there seems to be, on average, a higher level of intelligence here than there is at the kingdom hall.

  actually, intelligent conversation seems to be looked down upon among the witnesses.. also, the simple language skills found here seem to be above average compared to those among the witnesses.

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  Fred Franztone

  The idea that intelligence has nothing to do with brainwashing is an assertion that gets thrown around a lot. It's unfounded though, never backed up by anything. People take it as a given for no good reason

  I'm sure that intelligence and brainwashing must have some relationship, however faint
• 
  20

  A Field Service that gave a shock to the CO

  by Ireneus in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  during one co visit to our congregation, i was asked to work with co as i was a new publisher.

  after some ordinary visits, we entered a house where there was only a lady who proved be well-educated.

  though it was my turn, i told co to present the good news.

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  Fred Franztone

  he said: 'We will have some refreshment.'

  Why do they talk like that, it makes them sound like a bunch of freaks. I always hated it when I was growing up in the religion

  Why can't they just be normal for one moment and say food like everyone else
  
• 
  40

  This probably sounds uppity. I'm saying it anyhow

  by stillin in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  has anybody else noticed a pattern that is here among us outcasts?

  there seems to be, on average, a higher level of intelligence here than there is at the kingdom hall.

  actually, intelligent conversation seems to be looked down upon among the witnesses.. also, the simple language skills found here seem to be above average compared to those among the witnesses.

  1. 
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  Fred Franztone

  There are quite a few Christians here, so I'm not sure if I agree
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  25

  Did You Ever Find The Theolgy of JWs Reasonable?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  when i was a young man growing up in the religion, i would try to defend whatever the understanding of a doctrine was.

  i won a lot of arguments based on the idea that i knew better than anyone i was talking to and defended myself admirably.

  (lol)....eventually, i realized i was in a cult but for many years i was a believer and i had faith that the gb knew more that i could understand..

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  Fred Franztone

  They have so much bullshit that you ever look too critically at anything, they can simply direct your gaze elsewhere, it's a quintessential cult manoeuvre
• 
  23

  Why did you leave?

  by Fred Franztone in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  we all have many reasons for leaving, most are doctrinal, some are emotional.

  it's a religion which obsesses over factual proofs (counterfactual though they are) of its veracity rather than faith, so it's inevitable that most who leave will do so for intellectual reasons.

  which doctrine above all others forced you to reconsider your position?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Fred Franztone

  I'm not sure that this is completely accurate. They do a great job at making people believe that that's the case, but no, that's not what they are there for. Their main purpose is to exercise power over other people, not even money. Their teachings and all that study that they have to people doing is just the means, not the end.

  It's still an accurate description of how they work the rank and file members, regardless of their motives
  
• 
  23

  Why did you leave?

  by Fred Franztone in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  we all have many reasons for leaving, most are doctrinal, some are emotional.

  it's a religion which obsesses over factual proofs (counterfactual though they are) of its veracity rather than faith, so it's inevitable that most who leave will do so for intellectual reasons.

  which doctrine above all others forced you to reconsider your position?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Fred Franztone

  We all have many reasons for leaving, most are doctrinal, some are emotional. It's a religion which obsesses over factual proofs (counterfactual though they are) of its veracity rather than faith, so it's inevitable that most who leave will do so for intellectual reasons

  So what was it for you? Which doctrine above all others forced you to reconsider your position? For me it was a combination of studying evolution & geology, the lack of evidence for the flood and 607BCE, but primarily evolution
• 
  25

  Did You Ever Find The Theolgy of JWs Reasonable?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  when i was a young man growing up in the religion, i would try to defend whatever the understanding of a doctrine was.

  i won a lot of arguments based on the idea that i knew better than anyone i was talking to and defended myself admirably.

  (lol)....eventually, i realized i was in a cult but for many years i was a believer and i had faith that the gb knew more that i could understand..

  1. 
  2. 
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• 

  Fred Franztone

  I began finding holes in it as soon as I was old enough to read. One of the first irreconcilable things I noticed was that the great pyramid of Giza is older than the flood. This was when I was studying ancient Egypt at school as a 7 year old